944 Audi V8

Ok thanks for that, is 5.9" the amount of shaft sticking out past the torque tube face? I could really do with knowing that measurement.

Some great progress today, i took a long look at the engine and realized a lot of the firewall clearance issues will be down to the throttle body and water pipes at the rear of the engine, then i took a good look at the plenum itself and quickly saw the answer.... rotate the plenum!

So luckily the plenum is symmetrical, it will need a major replumb of vac lines and coolant etc but i now have a forward facing throttle body, this mod alone has just freed up 4-5" of space at the firewall.... i like this, a lot.

Now no clutter at all at the rear...

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Forward facing TB...

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I may have caused a problem with the ISCV being too high now for bonnet/hood clearance but i'll ditch it and just run ignition based idle control or a standalone aux air valve.

Yes, 5.9" is total shaft length past TT flange. That is cool to know the plenum is reverseable too. I was working with LeeZard today and discussing a mid-engine 944 build with this V8...it would work and still have plenty of seat position for a tall driver too. Would have to cut torsion tube and put a U-channel, then beef the coilover attachment points.

What are the two measurements?

hello, i looked at the mid engine option before i started my build. what is the lenght of the audi V8 verse the LS. The biggest issue i found was where the axles are located, even using the posche g5050 (had a line on one here in canada) the axels would sit back in to the body. I measured it all for the LS and the g50 and it moved the axles back a min of 7 to 8 inches. This set up had the motor sitting directly behind the seats and still could not get it far enough ahead to hit the fac location of the axles, u can buy a dff trans that would work but they start at around 10k. again just my two cents worth. I had an engineer come to my place to look at the car and calculate what would have to happen to the frame to make it safe. It would be a hell of a project, but would be fun to do.

XSchop what two measurements do you need?

Kevin i have the answer for your axle location issue if you were going mid mounted. I built an Audi V8 Mk1 Mr2, using the OBX trans, now that meant i had to mount the engine right behind the seats to get the axles in the right place, at the time this was the only option available to me, now in 2010 Audi released a new trans for their front wheel drive A5 to try and combat the understeer problem they suffer from, they did this by moving the front hubs 8" forward and built a new trans to deal with that.

The OB1 trans has the axles coming out right at the bellhousing face, i wish i had one of these before i built by V8 Mr2, it would have allowed me to place the V8 8" further back.

I bought an OB1 last year and proved it could be mounted onto the Audi V8, it took a little modifying, i had to cut the starter motor flange off the V8 block, but it works...

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The axle centre is 45mm from the bellhousing face, a saving of some 7" over the older type OBX.

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Here is the OB1 that i bolted to a V8 2 years ago proving it could work....

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It will need a custom flexplate to crank adapter, but meh, easy enough, the trans itself is much shorter than the older 6 speed too.

This will allow you to mount the V8 8" further back, hope that helps.

xschop wrote:With any 944 swap using the torque tube you need to ask 2 questions....

1) What is bellhousing depth
2) What is the pilot bearing face to engine block face measurement

Then you figure if your BH needs to be chopped or adapter added from the 5.9" shaft dimension when the factory rear coupler setting is set to 49 mm.

One things for sure, you are gonna have alot of room in the front.
I've seen that trans picture on GT40. What are it's gear ratios? and do you know it's strength comparo to say an O1E?

Someone on Gt40 has used my OB1 pic? Word travels fast on the internet i guess.

Sorry i don't know the ratios, i'd presume similar to the old A4 trans because this is the gearbox that superceeded it, i doubt they'd mess with the ratios too much.

The guy who is building an Audi V8 944 in tandem with me (we are sharing all information as we go) has also made good progress, he is doing it slightly differently to me because he just happened to have some parts that worked in his garage.

This is his custom flywheel, he had this made some years ago for a different project, it fits the V8 and is a lot narrower than my VAG flywheel...

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This means he could use the 924 bell without the spacer, just some tabs welded on and some machine work inside the bell...

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So we are both approaching this from a slightly different angle, both ways will work though.

Some great progress from the tandem build, we have a dummy fit of the engine to see where things need modifying, the brake booster still needs removing in these pics.

Ok let's dispell that myth that the Audi V8 does not fit in a 944 engine bay, it very much does...

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Of course it's sitting much further forward than it will be finally.

There is enough room for the stock headers, or slight notching of the strut tower ribs, no biggy.

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We have decided to go with an 80mm spacer between the bell and torque tube, and extend the coupler by the same at the rear, we will also be putting an extra carrier bearing at the front. 80mm will get us clear of the bulkhead completely, we can use the stock plenum orientation (i previously discovered the plenum is reversable 180* to give a front mounted intake) that is no longer needed, with the 80mm spacer it can all be left stock.

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We do have subframe clearance issues, big ones, so the Audi oil pump is going to be ditched, this will let us make a new lower sump pan to clear the subframe and run a dry sump system.

Have you tried the Boxster Flywheel or an off-the-shelf flywheel?
Also you can make the BH/TT spacer shorter (as well as coupler) and just move the whole drivetrain forward an inch or more to clear bulkhead.

Take pics from under neath if you can. Looks good.

I'm using an Rs4 fly on mine, Marc is using a custom made VAG fly on his which is much thinner.

We want to use an 80mm spacer because it lets us use the stock plenum orientation, just an inch would not be enough but we shall see, the oil pump/crossmember problem also dictates how far forward we need to go.

Again, what are the BH Depth and Pilot Bearing to block face dimensions?

Kevin is on the money with his LS mid engine dimensions. The Audi V8 would fit perfectly mid-engine since it is 8" shorter than the LS with accessories.

Sorry i haven't measured those, i didn't need to to be honest.

With the 924 BH and the Audi V6 spacer plate and my RS4 flywheel the pilot bearing sits in exactly the right place, ie the back of the bearing is exactly 5.9" away from the face of the torque tube.

Now today i chopped up my BH to see if i could get the Mondeo slave to work, so i cut the release bearing fork out and ground away excess material...

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This is the slave mocked up where it needs to be, now the good news is if i could mount it as it is here (if there was something to bolt it to) the distance inside the bell to clutch fingers is perfect, but unless i start chopping into the bell and welding in a mounting flange it won't work.

So the answer is to use a 10mm thick plate that is bolted to the BH and countersink the three trumpet bolts, then bolt the Mondeo slave to that plate. I will then need to use a second V6 spacer to get that 10mm back.... this will also move the engine forward another 10mm so i will make the BH to TT spacer 10mm shorter.

Sounds complicated, but it will work.

Nice. What TOB is that? I was told by another hybrider that the Chevy Cobalt TOB is exactly 1" shorter than the T56 TOB that we use on our swap...FYI

I'm not very familiar with US cars i'm afraid, so those parts are lost on me, but my TOB is from a UK Ford Mondeo, not sure if you guys got the Mondeo there or if it's called something else?

It's the perfect length for this setup if it could be bolted flat to the 924 BH, no extra spacers would be needed. Making a 10mm thick adapter plate and then just use another V6 BH spacer is just easier for me.

North American models marketed as the Ford Contour and Mercury Mystique until 2000, and as the Ford Fusion from model year 2013
-Wikipedia

Woodsport I'm really liking your project, have considered doing this same swap in a 968. So any updates?

Some more progress from Marcs US build, from now on most of the updates will be from his build as mine is my daily driver and i can't pull the engine until we have jointly worked everything out.

Temporary 80mm BH to TT spacer...

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With this spacer we have a very happy engine position and we are clearing the bulkhead...

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The oil pump assembly is going to need reworking, along with a new sump pan to clear the subframe...

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Marc has made his spacer adapter...

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The engine now bolted to the adapter and sitting where it needs to be...

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The block just clears the steering rack...

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With the subframe bolted up this is the area that needs work, new lower sump pan and oil pump configuration...

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Hood doesn't shut, so will need the subframe lowering a little or a power bulge...

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What part of the hood is hitting the engine. Looking good........

It's actually just the underwebbing, if we cut that off it will probably just clear the outer skin.

Pretty freaking cool. Subscribed.


Still shoulda bought a 928 and saved yourself the hassle

Heathen, i would but i don't want it to break down

Woodsport wrote:Heathen, i would but i don't want it to break down

95% of all 928's produced are still on the road today...




The other 5% actually made it home.

LOL ^^^ I genuinely laughed! Olie has yours been ok so far?

The new oilpan has been designed and is being tendered out this week...

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