Wilwood 260-7563 MC - mounting questions

This may have been covered here already - couldn't find through searches and images...

I'm using the single MC with a Summit bias adjuster + the custom mounting plate + the firewall reinforcement plate. A few questions/concerns are coming up as I piece together the lines and fittings.

[list=1][*]How to mount the driver's side coil packs - does anyone have photos or links of a sano installation that they could share?

[list=2][*]The brake lines for the bias adjuster exit the bottom of the MC and are VERY close to the header. I'm going to shop for some 90deg fittings (if available) to keep those lines as far as possible from the headers. It also looks like a good idea to fabricate a heat shield. Any examples of this to share.

I'll post some photos once progress on this is made.

Thank you in advance,
Dan.

When I do Hydro boost in stalls I move the coil packs to the strut tower, Works good and you can use the standard plug wires.

That makes sense - and that way you don't have to go with longer plug wires. Could you post a picture of how you mount them - wondering if it's better to mount the coils individually or use the OEM bracket provided.

Thanks,
Dan.

I had the heat issue with the lines running too close to the headers. It only showed up on the track after a LONG straight ( a place I REALLY needed brakes too,lol). Spun at Autobahn, spun at Mid ohio until i figured it out. I did two things; Insulated the lines themselves with some brake line insulators and made a heat shield that juts out from the engine under the m/c. Have not had the problem since. Heat shield was 1/8 stainless covered with some heat shield mat. The mat and the insulators came from DEI ( not dale jr, its a company in the Cleveland area easily found with a google search). Hope this helps.

Great advice - thank you. I think I'll end up making a heat shield as you describe and adding some jackets to the lines will certainly help as well.

Again - thank you.
Dan.

Thank you for the advise regarding the heat shield - much appreciated. I had time this weekend to make a simple heat shield and to mount the new master cylinder (MC).

There are 2 items that don't seem right.

Even with the coil packs removed from the valve cover, there is a clearance issue between the valve cover and master cylinder (see link below). If the engine rocks at all, it could come into contact with the MC. Also, with a modified brake pedal and pushrod, it doesn't appear that the pushrod and MC are in very good alignment.

Not sure that there's much room to adjust the motor at this stage. I'm using 944v8's engine mounting kit, and the motor/torque tube/transaxle are mounted correctly I think.

Are these common issues? Anyone able to point me to information on how to resolve this?

http://944x2.blogspot.com/

Thank you in advance. Dan.

I've tried a few combinations of MC, bias adjusters and brake pedal mods and have come up with a recipe that seems to work well for pedal feel and stopping power. The car is an '88NA chassis with late offset turbo/cup suspension bits.

Master Cylinder: Wilwood 260-8794
1" bore. Wilwood only sells this tandem MC in that size: http://www.wilwood.com/MasterCylinders/MasterCylinderList.aspx?minorname=Tandem%20Remote%20Master%20Cylinder

Bias Adjuster: Wilwood 260-10922
http://www.wilwood.com/MasterCylinders/MasterCylinderValves.aspx

Mounting plate: custom mounting plate and pushrod from Eric @ TPC. Mounting plate designed with slight angle to point the MC slightly away from the passenger side cyl head.

Calipers: Big reds front, 951 stock rear

Rotors: Kokeln hats front with 993 TT rotors, 968 rotors in rear.

Pedal:
I tried two different pedal ratios, .75" and 1" located above the stock pushrod location.

Heat shield:
the Wilwood MC is very close to the headers on the rear-most 2 cylinders. I fabricated a simple heat shield and used some of the alum/insulation heat shielding material which will hopefully deflect some heat away from the brake lines in that area.

Coil packs:
The rearmost coil #7 can be stacked with #5 for MC clearance.

My experience with this setup.
Because the MC is only available in 1" bore, I experimented with different pedal ratios. The .75" the pedal is very firm - too firm for me especially driving with cold racing pads on the street. At 1" the pedal feel is just about perfect, very positive without too much travel. Plus, the higher position of the pushrod allows for a better angle at the MC. The .25" difference between the two pedals I've tried results in a significant difference in feel. I may find another pedal and try .90" to firm up the pedal feel just a bit.

I'll be taking the car to the track for the first time this weekend and will report back on results.

If anyone else has additional advice regarding their setup - I'd welcome the input.

Thanks,
Dan.

Hey Dan, what are the piston sizes for your "Big Reds"?
I'm going to build a firewall plate for the Wilwood tandem and I also cannot find the Pushrod Adapter drawing that connects to the 944 pedal and Wilwood Tandem. I'll have to modify it as I am going to machine a 5 degree angle boss and weld it to the firewall plate. Does anyone have this drawing?

I have the drawing for the pushrod you made for me for the BMW hydroboost, not sure if that will help.

this what you're looking for? (from your pic poster...)

Those may work, but it's really not the correct design. The Wilwoods have a safety catch icorporated into their pushrods. I thought somebody made an adapter at one point with the M10 x1.5 threading to the Wilwood threading?

Sorry for the delay - I've been away for a few weeks.

Eric made the pushrod and firewall adapter plate I'm using. As mentioned in previous threads, the way my setup works, we needed to angle the MC slightly up and left to avoid interference with the cylinder head.

Also, I'm using a thin stainless firewall reinforcement plate and Eric's custom MC mounting plate sandwiched together.

I don't off hand know the piston sizes for the big red/951 caliper combo I'm using. Here's a link to an exhaustive list of brake system dimensions from a 911 brake Guru on Pelican:

http://members.rennlist.com/1976c38/brakes.htm

The 996 GT3 braking setup is interesting - not for additional stopping power, but using cheap Touareg rotors is tempting in comparison to the $300ea 993 TT rings. I've used the 993 TT vented rotors on the last two track cars I've had and they crack and groove prematurely.

One of the elements I'm not really pleased with in general is the clutch and brake hydraulics. For a winter project I'm considering switching to a floor mounted Tilton system, which would clean up the issues with clearance and proper alignment. That area on the firewall is just too busy - the extra cylinder head gets in the way!

Dan.

Thanks for the info. Do you have a pic of the Brake MC angle/mounting?
As for track braking you cannot beat the Cayenne/Touareg rotors, especially the price.

I'm thinking the same thing, Dan. Instead of going through all the work mounting master cylinders, relocating coils, making heat shields; I'm thinking of an interior pedal box. The Tilton floor mount is a beautiful thing. I'm also looking at the hanging setup from Wilwood. However, Eric gave some sage advice the other day, "don't try to reinvent the wheel."

Rich

http://www.wilwood.com/Pedals/PedalList.aspx

Rich L. wrote:I'm thinking the same thing, Dan. Instead of going through all the work mounting master cylinders, relocating coils, making heat shields; I'm thinking of an interior pedal box. The Tilton floor mount is a beautiful thing. I'm also looking at the hanging setup from Wilwood. However, Eric gave some sage advice the other day, "don't try to reinvent the wheel."

Rich

http://www.wilwood.com/Pedals/PedalList.aspx

So im needing to buy my MC's and am confused about what to buy as well. I dont like doing things twice so Id like to get it right the 1st time.

Looking at the wilwood pedals, without having one in hand im worried about getting them to fit becuase of the steering shaft. It goes right between the factory pedals. wouldnt this take some serious reengineering of the brackets under there?

"don't try to reinvent the wheel."

I dont think it would be that bad brian, the current reinforment that is there is for the current pedal setup, so if we cut all that out, installed the new pedal assembly and reinforced appropriatly it wouldnt be that bad. I like the look of those pedals!

Mark

Dan J wrote:I've tried a few combinations of MC, bias adjusters and brake pedal mods and have come up with a recipe that seems to work well for pedal feel and stopping power.  The car is an '88NA chassis with late offset turbo/cup suspension bits.

Master Cylinder: Wilwood 260-8794
1" bore.  Wilwood only sells this tandem MC in that size: http://www.wilwood.com/MasterCylinders/MasterCylinderList.aspx?minorname=Tandem%20Remote%20Master%20Cylinder

Bias Adjuster: Wilwood 260-10922
http://www.wilwood.com/MasterCylinders/MasterCylinderValves.aspx

Mounting plate: custom mounting plate and pushrod from Eric @ TPC.  Mounting plate designed with slight angle to point the MC slightly away from the passenger side cyl head.

Calipers: Big reds front, 951 stock rear

Rotors: Kokeln hats front with 993 TT rotors, 968 rotors in rear.

Pedal:
I tried two different pedal ratios, .75" and 1" located above the stock pushrod location.

Heat shield:
the Wilwood MC is very close to the headers on the rear-most 2 cylinders.  I fabricated a simple heat shield and used some of the alum/insulation heat shielding material which will hopefully deflect some heat away from the brake lines in that area.

Coil packs:
The rearmost coil #7 can be stacked with #5 for MC clearance.

My experience with this setup.
Because the MC is only available in 1" bore, I experimented with different pedal ratios.  The .75" the pedal is very firm - too firm for me especially driving with cold racing pads on the street.  At 1" the pedal feel is just about perfect, very positive without too much travel.  Plus, the higher position of the pushrod allows for a better angle at the MC.  The .25" difference between the two pedals I've tried results in a significant difference in feel.   I may find another pedal and try .90" to firm up the pedal feel just a bit.

I'll be taking the car to the track for the first time this weekend and will report back on results.  

If anyone else has additional advice regarding their setup - I'd welcome the input.

Thanks,
Dan.

hey dan what kind of wilwood pushrod would be able to use with the 260-8794 ?