HOW TO DO AN ADVANCED SEARCH.

Mon Jul 08, 2013 3:56 pm by Admin


For the benefit of 944Hybrids users there are two search functions available for you to use.
The purpose of this sticky is to explain the "Advanced Search" function because it is much more powerful and is the best choice when researching information.

When you log on to the site a list of options is shown in a line at the top of the page. One option is labelled "Search", use this option (NOT the search box lower down on the right).

After you click on the upper search option, a drop down box appears. At the bottom of this box is a radio button marked "Advanced …

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Brake Line Pressure

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Re: Brake Line Pressure

Post  Lemming on Thu Dec 08, 2011 9:19 am

I removed my bias valve when I put in my rear proportioning valve as I thought it to be redundant (this was before the DMC setup and I still retain the prop valve). Are you guys running bias valves with DMC setups?
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Re: Brake Line Pressure

Post  Arthropraxis on Thu Dec 08, 2011 10:18 am

I am not using a bias valve. I think Mike is.
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Re: Brake Line Pressure

Post  xschop on Thu Dec 08, 2011 10:23 am

Key is getting your MC's matched to the caliper piston sizes and fine-tuning with balance bar.
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Re: Brake Line Pressure

Post  Lemming on Thu Dec 08, 2011 11:44 am

Arthropraxis wrote:I missed the explanation of the force split front to rear. The first two manual systems I found, one on rennlist the other on the old site, both had the bigger MC on the front circuit. Why would the Tilton rep suggest to put the smaller MC in the front?

I'm guessing it would depend on setup. If you are not getting enough pressure to the front calipers after adjusting the balance bar then decreasing the piston size if one option. See write-up from tilton site below (section 3 specifically). I opted to go down in size as my pedal travel was minimal and my foot pressure was more than I wanted to deal with.

C. Adjustment and Operation
When running on pavement, you want the front tires to lock-up with slightly less pedal pressure than the rears. This will help to keep
the car stable and prevent it from going into a spin.
1. Loosen both of the jam nuts on the adjusting shaft (Item 3 in Diagram A).
2. Turn the adjusting shaft (Item 8 in Diagram A) using an allen wrench or the remote cable adjuster so that it advances
the spherical bearing closer to the selected master cylinder, increasing the braking force produced by that master
cylinder (Chart 2). The balance bar must be adjusted
with the pedal in the relaxed position (Diagram D).
3. The balance bar has a large adjustment range.
However, if you find that what you need is outside of
the adjustment range, you will need to make a master
cylinder bore size change. There are three possible
changes that can be made (See below). Both will
allow the spherical joint to move back towards the
center position.
a) Decrease the bore size of the master cylinder closest
to the spherical joint by 1/8". This will decrease the
amount of pedal force required from the foot and
increase the amount of pedal travel.
b) Increase the bore size of the master cylinder farthest from the spherical joint by 1/8". This will increase the
amount of pedal force required by the foot and decrease the amount of pedal travel.
c) Increase the bore size of the master cylinder farthest from the spherical joint by 1/16". Decrease the other master
cylinder bore size by 1/16". This will maintain the amount of force or pedal travel.
4. When satisfied with the adjustment bar location and force distribution, tighten both of the jam nuts (Item 3 in
Diagram A). Jam nuts are not required when a Remote Brake Bias Adjuster is use
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Re: Brake Line Pressure

Post  Arthropraxis on Thu Dec 08, 2011 2:57 pm

Thanks, that take some guess work out of it.
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Re: Brake Line Pressure

Post  87-944S on Fri Dec 09, 2011 9:12 am

Thanks Lemming, I have a Wilwood bias bar assembly, their instructions are seriously lacking in detail. I went to Tilton;s site and downloaded the intructions with the diagrams. I'm hoping armed with this info I can wrap this brake mess up.
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Re: Brake Line Pressure

Post  Lemming on Mon Dec 12, 2011 7:31 am

I'm pleased to say that going to a 5/8 front master cylinder fixed my problems. Pedal feel is much better, with around 3" of travel. I was easily able to get the balance bar setup correctly.

Here's the setup.

DMC with 5/8 front and 3/4 rear.

Front brakes are Turbo S calipers.

Rear brakes are Turbo/968 front calipers.
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Re: Brake Line Pressure

Post  xschop on Mon Dec 12, 2011 7:54 am

That's good news as it's close to my setup. What are your piston area calcs front and rear?
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Re: Brake Line Pressure

Post  Lemming on Mon Dec 12, 2011 8:27 am

xschop wrote:What are your piston area calcs front and rear?

I don't know.
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Re: Brake Line Pressure

Post  xschop on Mon Dec 12, 2011 12:03 pm

Has anyone installed the 928 MC with 23mm and 20mm bores?
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Re: Brake Line Pressure

Post  87-944S on Mon Dec 12, 2011 6:23 pm

Lemming, good to hear your is working well. So far I believe I will end up with the 5/8 front as well. I stripped the threads on my 3/4 inch, which was looking good for the rears. Will know more when I get a chance to work on it later this week. I fixed the slight binding, and started from center again with the pushrods of equal length for each M/C. I am seeing full stroke at the M/Cs, which I was not getting before. More to come.
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Re: Brake Line Pressure

Post  Arthropraxis on Sat Dec 31, 2011 8:53 pm

This thread can't die just yet. Lemming, how much is your pedal travel using the .625 MC? How much did it increase going down from a .75 to a .625?
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Re: Brake Line Pressure

Post  87-944S on Sun Jan 01, 2012 12:40 am

Not dead for me, just on the back burner for a bit, I have those wide body fendes to mess with. Very Happy
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Re: Brake Line Pressure

Post  Arthropraxis on Mon Feb 06, 2012 6:40 pm

I had a .70 FR and .813 R MC. I swapped the rear for a .625 MC. The pedal travel with the .813 Rear MC was minimal, felt like stepping on a brick. The pedal travel is increased and more compliant with the .625 rear MC and the balance bar changed to 60F/40R. There is still some air in the lines but this is already a better setup than what the Tilton tech recommended.
Per a calculator I found, this setup will give almost identical line pressures as the factory Turbo MC with the bias valve.


Last edited by Arthropraxis on Sun Feb 12, 2012 5:05 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: Brake Line Pressure

Post  Arthropraxis on Sun Feb 12, 2012 5:04 pm

I did some adjusting to the pushrods for the MC's and took the car for a drive. The brakes felt like a powered system with a firm pedal. The car didn't need any more stopping distance than it did with any other car. There was no threshold brake testing but at low speeds it was fine.

Brakes are done. Final setup: .70F .625R with the bias adjusted 60% to the front using stock 87 turbo brakes.
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