Clutch issues

I've always had some funny issues with my clutch, and i'm curious if anyone has any ideas. I'm running a Wilwood master cylinder (7/8?) and the RH slave setup.

My issue is that sometimes the clutch works great, sometimes it works very badly, and sometimes it seems somewhere in the middle. There's nothing i can identify that seems to be the culprit. Sometimes after work i'll get in and it shifts smooth like butter, another day i'll get in and feel the syncros snag on quite a few gears. It doesn't seem to be weather related or temperature related.

It's done it on two transaxles. Both have the good blue oil in them. I'm using the RH heavy-duty pressure plate and their Kevlar disc.

It does seem like the clutch gets hot--when i get off the freeway it's particularly bitchy. Not sure if i should give it some cooling ducts or something. I've made sure there are no high spots in the lines or fittings. I've bled and bled and bled it using a Motive bleeder and also the 2-man system. I'd like to think it's still got air in the lines, but if it's there, i don't know how else to get it out! (Plus i have a pretty big master cylinder, and the clutch seems to "release" at about 1/4 pedal)

Any thoughts?

It almost seems like your not disengaging at all times. I would check to see if your TT shaft completely stops when your clutch is depressed. I can hear my TT brgs go quiet when in neutral at a light when I step on the clutch. Maybe pilotbrg dragging TT shaft? Just a thought.

How are you bleeding it using the 2 man system and have you checked to see if you have any firewall flexing? Sounds to me like you still have some air in the hydraulics and when it gets hot the air is expanding and clutch action is going south. When bleeding I always depress and return the pedal very slowly and make sure when the pedal is returned the bleeder is completely closed. It usually takes 3-4 strokes of the pedal and its fully bled-good luck!

That's how i've been doing it with the 2-man method:

I say "pump" (they pump 3 times, then hold on the third)
While the pedal is depressed i open the bleeder for a second or two, then close it
I say "pump", they pull the pedal up, repeat step 1....

After i did it with the Motive it got better, but it still isn't quite perfect. Maybe i'll try again with the 2-man system now that the Motive got some of the air out.

Stop pumping the pedal just close the bleeder screw slowly depress the pedal by hand don't let it go down fast when the pedal is almost on the floor open the valve. When the pedal is on the floor close the bleeder screw and slowly raise the pedal back up by hand. Do this about 3 times and it should be bled. Are you sure that the clutch master was bled prior t6o going ot the slave? If not bleed it first by loosening up the line and ease the pedal down till you get fluid out around the fitting.

Okay, i'll give that way a shot. I had done that once or twice before, but switched back to the pumping method because that's what always worked for me!

sounds like what happens when you need a shim..have a read:

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and

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Wouldn't a shimming issue create a consistent problem?

Hmmm. Yeah, i'll have to check on the shimming. I guess i would say it's a "consistent" problem in that it's a problem more often than not. I also think that the clutches RH sells are SPEC, which seem to be the ones that need shims according to that post. Thanks!

Can you guys get into 1st gear from a 5-10mph roll? Do you have to wait a second to change gears?

RH sells Clutch Master Clutches not SPEC. If you use a shim be sure that the TO bearing is not preloading the diaphragm spring on the pressure plate. There needs to be some free play for the TO bearing to move backwards as the disc wears if there is not the clutch will slip when it as it wears. You can check this by looking inside the bell housing from the bottom and making sure the TO bearing is not bottomed out.

Good to know, thanks 968LS1.

I'm going to measure my system, but i'd rather have shims on hand when i do it (it will probably require removing the exhaust. Where could i get a set of shims?

other post on that site say to contact:

Jeremy Auvil
Sales and Tech Manager
SPEC, Inc.
800-828-4379 x.109
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(Spec sells shims.)

Ahh Jeez....
Well, before running to the store last night i had my g/f hold the clutch pedal on the floor. I cracked the bleeder, then closed it back up. Did that once more. Now it shifts perfectly!

I think where i was screwing up earlier was that i was pumping the pedal. The internet says that just makes big bubbles into a million little bubbles, which makes sense. My Motive bleeder wasn't getting it either (bought it just for this!).

Ah well, just glad to have it working

I think where i was screwing up earlier was that i was pumping the pedal. The internet says that just makes big bubbles into a million little bubbles, which makes sense. My Motive bleeder wasn't getting it either (bought it just for this!).

I thought with the Motive, you wouldnt have to pump the pedal. I was actually thinking of getting one of those Motive bleeder kits.

I always bleed my brakes from the slave using a oil can as a pump. Works wonderfully.

Dawgz: i came across that method on youtube when i was searching for the "best" way to bleed a clutch. Seems like a great idea! If i ever have to start from scratch i'll do that next time.

I thought with the Motive, you wouldnt have to pump the pedal. I was actually thinking of getting one of those Motive bleeder kits.

You definitely don't want to pump the pedal with the Motive, but when i was bleeding it manually that's what i had been doing. When i used the motive bleeder i also paused halfway through, relieved all the pressure from the Motive, then pumped the pedal a few times thinking that would push any remaining bubbles into the slave. Turns out it just makes a million little bubbles that are impossible to get out!

I use the Motive sometimes and also have a mighty vac. The motive system works well especially if you have a totally new system to fill with fluid because it pushes the fluid from the reservoir all the way out to the bleed valves - on the brakes, clutch or whatever. The mighty vac is nice if you just want to bleed something quickly, but it's not very good for filling a system that's empty. You've gotta have the right cap adapter though (Motive offers several) so it securely fastens to the reservoir though or you'll have a mess.

Dan.

Actually slowly working the pedal while pressure bleeding does help remove all the air. Its how i do it on all my clutch bleed jobs.

HTH
Mark